且行且摄I Photograph as I go
——澳大利亚著名摄影师休·布朗专访
-Famous Australian Photographer Hugh Brown Interview
-记者 沈珞Reporter Luo Shen
记者：是什么原因促使您辞去原来的工作，从事纪实摄影？是因为工作与爱好所必须专注的矛盾？
Reporter: What made you quit your job and engage in documentary photography? Is it because of the conflict between your work and the need of concentration for your passion?
休：我大学毕业后在目前世界上最大的矿业公司从事管理咨询工作，我实在厌倦了，但那份工作让我学会解决问题的方式，有时候可能不止一个。
但是最初很难选择，因为曾经一些热爱追求的东西都随着激情冷却消失殆尽，幸运的是摄影没有。即使你不说我爱摄影本身，我也爱它带我进入的世界——体验过的生活、经历过的冒险、遇到的人，让我感到丰富多彩。
但摄影跟其他工作一样都需要努力工作。多数人能做的简单的事情反而是最困难和最具磨难的。只有你当回事了，才能做得更好。
Hugh: After I graduated from college I worked in the world's largest mining company as a management consultant, I got really tired of it, but the job so taught me ways to solve problems.
But initially it was difficult to choose, because passion sometimes slips away when you are pursuing the things you once love, but fortunately not photography. Even if you do not say I love photography itself, I love the world it brings me into – the life I experienced, the adventures, people I met, they make me feel rich.
But photography is like any other works, needs you to work hard. The simple things that most people can do become the most difficult tribulation. Only when you take it seriously, you can do better.
记者：现在，有一种观点，摄影如果要控诉，就必须要先震慑。这种震慑很多时候是煽情，您如何看待？
Reporter: Now, there is a view, if photography wants to be appealing and advocacy, you must first deter, This deter are often provocative, what do you think?
休：震慑只能作为摄影的一个工具，我希望我的照片是惊人而不是震慑，能吸引观众，让他们觉得我的照片很有意思，从中发现真诚。现在我们拍摄都过多沉浸于自己的世界，忘记了周围的世界和他人的需要。我相信，追求轰动效应可以很简单，但传达诚实和正直才是重要的。
Hugh: deter only is a tool of photography, I hope that my photographs are amazing and not shcking, to attract the audience, so that they feel my picture is very interesting, and found the sincerity. Now that we have taken too much immersed in our own world and forget the needs around the world and others. I believe that sensationalism can be very simple, but to convey honesty and integrity is important.
记者：您如何在摄影中把握商业、艺术与真实？三者怎么排序？
Reporter: How do you grasp the business, art and reality in photography? How the three sort?
休：我更愿意选择自己的主题并做好它，然后试图解决销售和市场工作。如果你真的热爱你会做得很好，并找到可行的路。采用我的方式挑战是有时会使你生活困难，但也是对自己的挑战，想出更好的解决方案和超越想象的最终产品。
Hugh: I prefer to choose my own theme and do it, and then try to solve sales and marketing efforts. If you really love what you do well and find a viable way. The challenge is to adopt my way sometimes it make your life difficult, but also its a challenge for you,to come up with better solutions and make a final product that is beyond the imagination.
记者：对于主题纪实摄影，经常要为一个主题，重复不断地观察和跟踪记录，您如何持续保持这种重复中的激情？
Reporter: For the theme documentary photography, often you need to constantly observe and track record repeatedly for one theme, how do you continue to maintain this repetition of passion?
休：纪实摄影很多时候要等摄影对象对你厌烦，当你不存在时，你才能畅通无阻工作。我有个伙伴对我说，你钓鱼的时候需要知道什么时候留下来等待，什么时候起身去抓鱼。纪实摄影就像钓鱼。
不仅仅是纪实摄影，很多镜头的拍摄都具有挑战性，让我始终保持激情。最长的一次我为了拍摄一个镜头等待了30多天，当时我几乎不确定会不会出现。
Hugh: documentary photography often has to wait for your photographic object to be bored of you and feel you do not exist anymore, only then you can work unimpeded. I have a mate told me that when you are fishing you need to know when to stay and wait, what time to get up to catch fish. Documentary photography is like fishing.
Not just documentary photography, many shoots are challenging too, so I am always passionate. The longest time I shoot a shot, I waited more than 30 days, I was almost not sure anything would come up.
记者：此次到奉化拾荒者公寓拍摄，和您之前的想象有何不同？拍摄老太太，您的出发点是什么？
Reporter: The shoot about Fenghua scavengers apartment, before you went, was your imagination any different than the reality? Shoot the old lady, what is your consideration?
休：我想说这儿的政府已经做得很好了，拾荒者公寓改善了500多人的生活，提供高标准住宿。我不记得在我到过的其他国家有这样的情况。我为什么拍摄老太太尤其是脸部特写，是因为她的脸有很多故事。 (本次采访得到韩培生老师、俞旭晖先生的大力支持。)
Hugh: I would say the government has done a good job here, and the scavengers apartment improves the lives of more than 500 people, offers a higher standard accommodation. I do not remember the other countries I have been to such a situation. Why do I shoot that old lady especially the close-up to her face, is because her face tells a lot of stories. (This interview is greatly supported by Mr Hanpei Sheng, Mr. Yu Xuhui's.)
休·布朗，澳大利亚专业摄影师，长期从事纪实拍摄，用镜头捕捉正在消失的风貌。2006年，他开始在世界各地参与矿工项目的摄影，去印尼的活火山拍摄人工提取硫磺，去印度拍摄一些手工煤矿，在澳大利亚的皮尔巴拉和金伯利地区拍摄了16年，并拍摄生存探险的纪录片。今年4月25日至5月4日，休·布朗在宁波举办“日渐缩小的世界”摄影展，之后陆续在宁波(包括奉化)、青岛、上海等地拍摄。
Hugh Brown, Australian professional photographer, has long been engaged in documentary photography, using camera to capture the disappearing world. In 2006, he started to photograph miners around the world, he went to Indonesian volcano to shoot manual extraction of sulfur, to India to shoot some hand miners, in the Pilbara and Kimberley region of Australia he has been taking photos for 16-years, and shoot survival adventure documentary. This year April 25 to May 4, Hugh • Brown held "Aspect of a shrinking world" photo exhibition in Ningbo, after that he was in Ningbo (including Fenghua), Qingdao, Shanghai and other places to shoot.
记者：您说一直在捕捉“日渐逝去的世界”，但在异国他乡您如何知道哪些生活方式即将逝去？怎样判断您眼中的普通个体是否游离于整体，是真正的即将逝去的生活方式？
Reporter: You said had been captured "Aspect of the disappearing world", but in a foreign country how do you know what life is about to slip away? How to determine if the ordinary individuals in your eyes are separated from the whole, is truly living a lifestyle that is disappearing?
休：这个问题分两个方面。一方面是客户委托我拍指定主题，通常都是被重复拍摄的主题，挑战就是找到不同的角度。比如矿业是很难拍摄的，因为基本上一个矿洞就是一个矿洞，它通常是灰色或红色，有时候是白色的，齿轮看起来都一个样。我试着晚上工作，有时整晚，这样我就能控制光线，虽然既累又难，但值得。
Hugh: two aspects to this issue. One is my client asked me to shoot the specified topic, usually repeated theme, the challenge is to find different angles. For example, mining is hard shot, because basically a mine is a mine, it is usually gray or red, sometimes white, gear looks alike. I try to work at night, sometimes all night, so I can control the light, although tiring and difficult, but worth it.
另一方面，如果说我自己选择的话，我看过世界上很多有趣的事物，这让我有了一双锐眼，我相信如果眼前的事物能让我印象深刻，那肯定是好的。我喜欢拍六七十岁老年人的特写，他们的脸总能说出故事。我不觉得个体和整体必须要有联系，出于本能，我选择的主题作为单个的整体都是不寻常且很快会不存在的。
On the other hand, if I choose the topic, I have seen a lot of interesting things in the world, it gives me sharp eyes, I believe that if things make me impressed immediately, it is certainly good. I like to shoot close-ups for sixty and seventy years old elderly, their faces always tell stories. I do not think the individual and overall are necessarily relevant, instinctively, I chose the topic as a single whole that are unusual and will soon not exist anymore.
记者：中国的改革开放进行了30多年，这些年城镇化加速，社会急剧变化，这为纪实摄影提供了巨大的空间，这段时间，您在宁波、青岛以及其他一些地方主要拍摄了什么？
Reporter: China's has reformed and opened up for more than 30 years, accelerated urbanization these years, dramatic changes in society, which provides a huge space for documentary photography, at this period of time, what your main subject is in Ningbo, Qingdao and other places?
休：我对产业链的下端比较感兴趣，特别是在我一直拍摄的西澳大利亚皮尔巴拉钢铁厂的许多工作关停后。我非常感谢这里的人们给我足够的信任允许我看到这些行业在地球另一端是怎样的。
Hugh: I have more interests in the lower end of the industrial chain, especially after I've taken a lot of photos in Western Australia's Pilbara iron and steel factories after shut down. I am very grateful to the people here that gave me enough trust to allow me to see what in these industries is like in the other side of the.
我也对这里的工人很感兴趣，因为这儿有一些关于中国快速发展的精彩故事可以讲述。西方国家对中国知道的很少，我们需要知道在这些崛起和发展的城市中人们是怎样生活的。我在这儿接触的每个人都告诉我发展让他们有了更好的生活，这些是西方国家需要更好理解的。
I am also very interested in the workers here, because there are some wonderful stories about China's rapid development to tell. Western countries know very little about China, we need to know in the risen and developed city how people live. Everyone I meet here told me to development of the city make their life better, those are what the Western countries need to better understand.
记者：纪实摄影最大的困难不是“如何拍”，而是“拍什么”，您最想通过摄影作品，告诉读者什么？
Reporter: The biggest difficulty about documentary photography is not "how to shoot", but "shoot what", what do you want to tell the reader through Photography,?
休：摄影跟用笔写故事其实没有不同，都是传达信息。在去现场之前都要尽可能多地做一些调查，多阅读多了解主题，理解独特之处，研究他人的工作。
我喜欢给照片用短的描述性标题，不会让观众带走定型的故事。观者从图片获取的故事是通过怎么拍和拍什么形成的。早期，当我对拍摄的事物陈述不出观点时我会很不舒服，但随着我的成长，我觉得这反而成为一种长处。观众会形成自己的看法，我不能也不应该试图控制他们的意见。
一个例子就是我拍摄(印度、西非一些国家)的手工采矿工已经到一定的阶段。通过作品，也许会促使政策制定者面临挑战，即保护和平衡好的元素并消灭坏的现象，同时也让发达国家越来越变得自满懒惰的人们得到启示和警醒。
Hugh: Photography is different with writing, though there are both delivering information. Before going to the field I do as much research as possible, read more to know more about the theme, understand the uniqueness and research work of others.
I like to use a short descriptive title for my photos, I do not let the audience take away stereotypes story. The viewers take the stories from the photos through how its shot and what it contains. Early on, when I could not describe the subjects I took or when I couldn't make a viewpoint on them, I felt very uncomfortable, but as I grew up, I think it turned out to be an advantage. The audience will form their own views, I can not and should not try to control their opinions.
An example is I have been taking photos of (India, West Africa countries) artisanal mining workers , it have reached a certain stage. Through work, perhaps it makes policy makers face the challenge of protecting and balancing the good and eliminate the bad elements of the phenomenon, but also to make the ungrateful and lazy peoplein the developed countries to get inspirational alert.
记者：您能和读者分享一下从事纪实摄影以来印象最深的事情？
Reporter: Can you share with the readers about the most impressive thing you have ever seen since you engaged in documentary?
休：在印尼拍摄硫磺加工厂，营地就在活火山口300米之外的地方。那些工人要走1公里左右的路上山去活火山口取矿石，然后举着100多公斤的矿石在崎岖的火山岩石缝里往下走3公里，有时脚被灼得惨不忍睹。因为长期在活火山口工作，喷发出来弥漫在空气中的硫磺把他们的牙齿腐蚀得黄黑。在这样的环境下，人是如此的渺小。火山随时可能喷发，把人湮没，但是拍摄出来的瞬间又如此美丽。
去年在印度，我看到了一些非常落后的地方，四五岁的小孩们遍布道路。那天上午，我先是看到一个男人胳膊上挂着一个看上去死了的孩子，有二十来人围观。再往前10多米，马路中间又躺着一个死去的孩子，乍看像是个布娃娃。可是面对生命逝去我们却无能为力。我的司机用掌击头，车里一片沉默。
Hugh: In the sulfur processing plant in Indonesia, where the camp is only 300meters away from the rim of the live volcano. Those workers walk about 1 km to go up to take the sulfur on the rim of the volcano, then holding more than 100 kilograms of ore to walk three kilometers downthe crevices of rugged volcanic rock, and sometimes their feet were burned terribly. Because of the long-term work in the rim of a live volcano, the sulfur erupted in the air corroded their teeth yellow and black. In such an environment, people are so insignificant. Volcano may erupt at any time and bury all people, but the momentscaptured there are so beautiful.
In India last year, I saw some very poor places, four-year-old children all over the road. That morning, I first saw a seemingly dead child hanging on the arm of a man, there are twenty people looking at them. 10 meters away, in the middle of the road lay a dead child, at first glance it was like a rag doll. But, with the passing of life we an not do anything. My driver hit his own head with his own hand, we were very silent in the car.